I don't have HBO so I missed this, but apparently on Tuesday night Bryant Gumbel ended his "Real Sports" show by reading an open letter* to Mark McGwire, taking him to task over his apology. While it was silly because it (a) was premised on the notion that anyone should care what Mark McGwire thinks steroids did for him; and (b) assumes that, while he was a private citizen in California this past decade he had any obligation to explain to anyone what he did or did not take in his career, the criticism was nothing new. What was new, however, were the names Gumbel named at the end of the letter:
"In closing, guys, please feel free to share this letter with Bagwell, Nomar, Pudge and all those others who went from hitting homers to power outages overnight. Tell 'em fans are ready to accept what happened. Tell 'em we're ready to move on. Tell 'em that most of us get it...even if they, like you, still don't."So there you have it. Gumbel is now the first person to publicly accuse Jeff Bagwell and Nomar Garciaparra
In other news, I am waiting for comments from all of the writers who took the blogger Jerod Morris to the woodshed last year for writing that it was possible, based on a statistical pattern, that Raul Ibanez had used PEDs. Gumbel is just accusing without any evidence, so he's even worse, right? And if your answer is "well, we know Bagwell, Pudge and Nomar took 'roids, so this isn't so bad," why the hell haven't you reported it yet?
*If I were made dictator of the planet, one of the first things I'd do is to make the practice of "open letters" punishable by death. You wanna say something to someone, write them a letter. You want to tell your readers or viewers what you think of someone else, tell them what you think. Open letters are lazy-ass gimmicks with allow the writer to smugly pretend that they're giving someone advice when he's really being a passive-aggressive condescending prick. They're the literary equivalent of "hey, I'm just sayin.'" How about this: just say it.


If Bryant Gumbel said it, it must be true. He still has a show?
Canseco implicated Pudge in "Juiced."
Didn't Nomar and Bagwell get implicated in the Mitchell Report? I honestly can't remember, just wondering.
WHO CARE ANYMORE? It is over. It was a blemish on the game. Label all those stats from those years with an asterisk and let's move on with life already. This has been the longest, most drawn out "scandal" in the history of sports. I am tired of it being on the top of the news.
I like it -- open season on anyone who had fluky seasons! Roger Maris, steroid user! Hank Aaron, late career steroid user! Sandy Koufax and Pedro Martinez, obvious steroid users! Obviously we have to target the players who had the one year out of character career seasons (Maris, Brady Anderson, Luis Gonzalez, Adrian Beltre). Since Gumbel is accusing Bagwell, then anyone who had a huge power jump used (Bagwell, Edgar Martinez, Kirby Puckett). Finally we need to target the ripped players (Nomar, Gabe Kapler, Frank Thomas). However, what if players fit in one category but not another like Tony Gwynn? He hit for power late in his career but he was fat as hell. Or Miguel Cabrera (not totally fat yet but getting there).
This could be a fun game. We can go through each players statistical record and figure out what seasons he used steroids.
Howard: thanks. Fixed it.
And no, Bagwell and Nomar were not in the Mitchell Report. They were listed in a phony list that came out the day before the release, but they were not included.
And to be clear: I would not be the least bit shocked if any of them had been steroid users. My problem is that the media gets to have it both ways: completely ignoring steroids for years on the one hand, but crucify players for not "coming clean" earlier on the other. Excoriating a blogger for meekly suggesting that someone may have possibly used steroids on the one hand but letting guys like Gumbel and a bunch of others just throw out names with no evidence whatsoever.
As the days go by Criag it sounds more and more like you are defending McLiar.The fact is he cheated like the other users and he still won't come clean.He is lying about his performance , ever wonder why they call them perfomance enhancing drug's.
Why can't Gumble have an opinion, he paid his taxes, I assume and he has a show where he is paid to voice his opinion whether you agree or not.
Opinions are like toilet paper, when you are finished you flush them down the toilet bowl. I authored that line, so pay me to use it, ok.
As the days go by Criag it sounds more and more like you are defending McLiar.The fact is he cheated like the other users and he still won't come clean.He is lying about his performance , ever wonder why they call them perfomance enhancing drug's.
Why can't Gumble have an opinion, he paid his taxes, I assume and he has a show where he is paid to voice his opinion whether you agree or not.
Opinions are like toilet paper, when you are finished you flush them down the toilet bowl. I authored that line, so pay me to use it, ok.
Craig, haven't discussed this yet with Ken Rosenthal, but past experience tells me that he probably thinks Bryant Gumbel is being ridiculous and does not respect the power of the written word.
Bagwell was isn't in the Mitchell report. And where is Bagwell's power outage? Last five full seasons he hit 47,39,31,39 and 27. He hit three the next year, but only had 100 at bats and could barely throw across the infield. I just don't see an outage there.
Don't forget Boone and his MVP season, the next year he got released and could not make the Mets team and quit in spring training, talk about one hit wonders,,,,,,,,,,,
Great point. Who cares.
Let's get back to something more important like the Negro League debates.
Lets find out how many homeruns Josh Gibson actually hit instead worrying about how many McGwire might have or might not hit.
I will defend McGwire from what I feel are unfair attacks. He said what he did. He's deluded if he thinks that steroids had no effect on his hitting, but that's what he believes. Is McGwire not entitled to his opinion too?
Ultimately of course who cares what McGwire thinks? If he said that he took steroids because a little man on his shoulder told him to it doesn't chance a single thing about what he did on the field. Let scientists, historians and people who know a bit about this kind of thing figure out how much his performance was enhanced. McGwire's opinion is irrelevant.
As for Gumbel, he's not merely offering his opinion here. He's very clearly accusing Bagwell Nomar of taking steroids and demanding that they too come clean. That's not an opinion. That's an accusation, and accusations should be backed up with evidence.
You know what would be great? If Players who are implicated in steroids, or other wrong doings, by these "reporters" who are just riding the wave trying to scrape up ratings, would just wait outside of the said reporters home and beat the total snot out of them for it. Totally awesome!!! I'm imagining it now, sally boy Gumble getting a pile driver from Pudge!! woo hoo!!!! My hero!!!
Isn't the "open letter/advice" to the audience/a target person how Jerry Springer signs off his shows? I guess then the lesson is to confess your steroid use, or that you really ARE the father of your secret lover's baby, depending upon from which show the advice is offered.
I don't know why we're letting eveyone else off so easy and just body slamming atheletes. Herve Villachaize definitely was a steroid user. Stephen Hawkings? Obviously, you can tell by the power outage. James Arness? Plant sap, my ass. So, I'm willing to bet, was Mighty Joe Young, who was a squirrel monkey early in his career. And what about Jim Cantore on the Weather Channel? Look at the size of that guy. You going to tell me you need a build like that to read computer models? Puh-leeze. Let's have a closer look at Paris Hilton. No serial numbers? Steroids! Let's level the playing field.
Earth to the world-- Athletes have been taking steroids since the early 60's...100% of offensive linemen in the NFL still take something... evolution hasnt magically produced 300 pounders that bench 600 lbs and run a 4.8 40 over the last 30 yrs... its better living through chemistry...
I miss "Gumbel to Gumbel: Beach Justice".
Wow, Craig, we're punchy today. I love the aggressive tone of today's posts, though. Keep getting slapped around a little, or whatever it is that happened before you wrote today.
The size of Leno's jaw proves he uses steroids. That's how he beat out Letterman in the ratings and how he was able to get his old show back. You know he had a roid rage fit and pulverized some NBC execs until they caved.
Boone was not released the year after his career season. He had an amazing 2001, and a pretty good 2002, an awesome 2003, an average 2004 and then a crappy 2005 - -the year he was released. the twins picked him up, then dropped him after a few weeks. I'm not saying he didn't juice, I'm just saying the dropoff was not as pronounced as you imply.
I am more concerned that Craig dosent have HBO
It's more likely that Leno suffers from a highly localized form of acromeglia, a kind of Rondo Haddon with precision crafting. If he were on steroids, his jokes would be a hell of a lot funnier.
"Opinions are like toilet paper, when you are finished you flush them down the toilet bowl. I authored that line, so pay me to use it, ok."
Analogies are like orange juice: no matter how many times you catch that fish, there will always be a brown paper bag to fold.
Ha!!!!!!
Look at this and tell me with a straight face that he wasn't juicing.
http://cache.boston.com/images/bostondirtdogs//Headline_Archives/NG_cover_SI.jpg
I think the evidence will come out when some of these cheaters come down with Lyle Alzado's problems and other similar ailments in a number to large to be statistically likely in a random sample.
Remember, he came clean at the end, said it was not worth it and blamed the steroids.
Please keep up the good work Craig. Someone needs to hold the hypocrites accountable. Seems to me that all the writers are out for is the "gotcha" moment. Also, I hope that Gumbel gets the Jerrod Morris treatment but I suspect that it will not happen.
Not classy, Mr. Classy and Self-Righteous. Jay suffers from mandibular prognathism, which may also account for his minor speech impediment as well. Super-classy. Do you go up to people in wheelchairs and make fun of them? Classy. I just hate that word, and now I hate you. I can't even hear it without thinking of the words "broad" as in "she was a classy broad" or Chassy. As in - classy chassy can't hold the transmission.
Has Bryant Gumbel stopped beating his wife?
"He's deluded if he thinks that steroids had no effect on his hitting..."
I don't understand why people insist on hearing McGwire say, "Yes, they helped me hit more home runs." Isn't it better this way? Maybe I'm naive, but at it's least more of a deterrent for potential users to say they did not help. If McGwire is saying they didn't help him hit--and in turn help him make a buttload of money--maybe kids will think twice about using them. But if he says they did help, what kind of message is he sending? "I used steroids and they did indeed help me hit homers. But even though they make you great and will help you earn millions of dollars, you probably won't be elected to the Hall of Fame. So you shouldn't use them."
I have McGwire's messages right here:
- My #'s are legit please let me in the HOF, please
- I'm only standing here today because they made me they said I had to if I wanted to be a coach
- I'm not here to talk about the past
I personally love that Gumbel did this. If he's right, they can't really do anything about it - it ain't libel or slander if it's true. I wish more journalists would nut up and take their shots.
...and to hell with journalistic standards.
Does anyone else besides me think that Cal Ripkens record could be tainted? I never thought that one would be broken.
If you are going to hold all the "steriod-era" players in contempt, and hold them to a "guilty until proven innocent" standard, what about ALL the other "cheaters" in the game that are allowed to "skate" by because they are considered "hallowed." Didn't Gaylord Perry "juice" the ball? What about Joe Neikro and the nail file in his back pocket? Perry was inducted into the hall and Neikro was considered one of the best pitchers in the game. The writers (and Gumbal) want to have their cake and eat it too.
two words Brady Anderson
Just off the top of my head, Maris was not a one year wonder in 1961-he was the mvp the year prior as well. And were steroids even available 30,40,50 years ago? I would tend to doubt it!
That analogy is to analagous! As for steroids - whatever. They all cheat. It's just like the real world in that respect. And when is it new for journalists to have a 2 faced personality? They have always been wanting it both ways.
I remember a few years ago when Brian Gumbal was at the top of his game,since then his exposure has dropped off. Think he used steroids. eh.....
All we need to do is see which of these sluggers has bacne. There's your proof!
From what I am reading the point the author is trying to make is not who used and who didn't, but rather you can't plug your ears and yell LA LA LA LA LA and then the next minute start throwing people under the bus with no evidence at all. You either investigate and produce evidence or you do the usual bland reporting that everyone else does.
My response to that (and that only) is that any news media outlet, including those that cover sports, has LONG since abandoned digging for facts and unconvering a story and is much more about creating a story and hoping random facts show up or that the fanciful story gets enough people to look that someone else works on the facts.
It's an open secret in beantown that Garciaparra was on the juice, along with Kapler, Manny, Big Papi and a few others! Old news in New England. Go around to the Gold's Gyms in Boston and ask around!
And people who start to throw Babe Ruth, Henry Aaron, and Roger Maris into a steriod conversation are idiots! If you want to throw a modern player from the 80's on then that's fair game, but spare us the mention of steriods when we're talking about the 19th Century and Babe Ruth and Henry Aaron and Reggie Jackson and George Foster. You sound like an ignorant monkey when mentioning steriods with these players who didn't even know how to spell the word steriod.
www.google.com
Search the internet for stuff...like this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anabolic_steroid#History
Carlton still has a show? C'mon this guy is so boring as a sports reporter it is ridiculous. It's the same old crap just repackaged by someone else trying for another 15 minutes of fame. If you want to know who 'juiced' wait 10 or so more years and these guys will start dropping like flies.
Gumball is delusional. Bagwell played the early part of his career in a cavern calleed the Astrodome; thirty home runs a year there was quite a feat. However, if steroids are performance enhancing, maybe Gumball better roid up! It might help him as he's fallen into the afterthought category of reputable reporters.
Steroids were around over a hundred years ago.....
Yep. Anabolic steroid research began as early as the 1930s.
Yes, so our choices are, basically, to stand idly by and accept it or to hold people accountable.
Not the same thing Carlos.
"You sound like an ignorant monkey when mentioning steriods with these players who didn't even know how to spell the word steriod."
Apparently neither can you. Also, before you flail around like a spastic weasel, please do a little research on when steroids and other PEDs were available.
I would say it's probably..........True!
"You sound like an ignorant monkey..."
You sure about that? Ever heard of the East German Swim Team scandal in the '76 Olympics? That occurred right around the time Jackson and Foster were playing. Google it! Also check out the link above from (Not That) Tom. The truth is a pretty interesting thing.
I'm not sure how to take your spelling comment. Were you trying to be funny by misspelling "steroids"? Or are you suggesting the inability to spell a word would stop guys from using? Because that would really put a damper on the manufacturers of androstenedione, nandrolone, stanozolol, clomifene, deca-durabolin, etc. Maybe that's why they called amphetamines "greenies" back in the day. Way easier to spell.
Trainer: Here dude, take this. It'll make you bigger and stronger.
Player: Sounds great! What are these called?
Trainer: Steroids.
Player: How do you spell that?
Trainer: Not sure, actually. But look at these pecs and tell me that's not something you want.
Player: I don't know, sounds fishy. I'd like to know how to spell steroids.
Grandpa Fred: Well you don't spell it, son, you eat it.
"My problem is that the media gets to have it both ways: completely ignoring steroids for years on the one hand, but crucify players for not "coming clean" earlier on the other."
Craig you hit the nail on the head, everyone ignored it the media, the fans, the owners and even poor Bud and the rest of MLB. We all loved the home runs, the power pitchers, attendance was up, the game had the country's attention and all that after the Strike of 94 hurt the game as much as it did, we had a reason to watch again. I do remember the media and the fans love affair with Sammy Sosa and Mark Maguire's homerun race in 1998. We all turned a blind eye and now want to condemn.
I dont think someone of Gumbel's background would just come out throwing accusations about players without having some sources. Gumbel knows he could be sued for slander, so he must know some stuff that hasnt gotten out.Personally I think the list of 103 needs to be exposed and then we all move on. Whoever isnt on the list deserve to be left alone. In this country Its suppose to be innocent until proven guilty,right O.J.?
Gumble is pompous you know what and I do remember some comments that cam out of his mouth that made me wonder if he was a racist as well. I have no respect for him, will not watch him and don't take anything he says as gospel.
Its great that the "voice of reason" is calling for the violation of 103 people's constitutional rights.
"And were steroids even available 30,40,50 years ago? I would tend to doubt it!"
Google Sports Illustrated, steroids, timeline & you'll see that steroids have been around since 1889 (120 years ago). There was an article on this very topic also just a few days ago.
I love my pet cat. It is furry.
Thank you!! It's especially important to remember that the Hall of Fame voters have to be BBWAA members for at least 10 years. In other words, the latest any voter for the most recent HoF class could have become a baseball writer was 1999--while McGwire was still playing, before Bonds broke the HR record & before the BLACO story broke. The vast majority were writers during the 1998 season. I've yet to hear any of them "come clean" and explain why they did not investigate despite the rampant rumors of steroid use.
I've noticed Anderson Cooper has Bulked up any one going after reporters and anchors who use PED ROIDS ? and how are we to trust someone who reports News while "Juiced up" Yet not a single
CBS NBC ABC has asked A/C if he is juiced Lora Logan who had an
extremarial affair is still giving the news yet Tiger is hounded
"Just asking"
HEY - I AM STILL PISSED ABOUT HARRY CARY BEING FIRED BY AUGGIE BUSCH!!
We have freedom of speech here and you think an open letter should be grounds for the death penalty? Oh yeah, and what do you do for a living--sell your opinion Nooooooooo!!
I love your comment on open letters! Absolutely right. Open letters are for wusses who want to bitch about something and not be held responsible for what they say. Say it and take the heat or shut the hell up. Even if I disagree with you I can at least respect you.
Wasn't pudge's named leaked with the steriods list of 2003?
I read in Ted Williams's book he drank milkshakes from high school on so he could bulk up (he was too skinny). Now I know how he hit so many homers and over .400 --- bovine steroids, the ultimate PED. Ted was way ahead of the curve once again, but he didn't come completely clean; he probably thought no one would make the connection. Ha, you're busted Ted. Someone better tell Dumbell so he can flail on him too at the end of his next HBO show.
I read in Ted Williams's book he drank milkshakes from high school on so he could bulk up (he was too skinny). Now I know how he hit so many homers and over .400 --- bovine steroids, the ultimate PED. Ted was way ahead of the curve once again, but he didn't come completely clean; he probably thought no one would make the connection. Ha, you're busted Ted. Someone better tell Dumbell so he can flail on him too at the end of his next HBO show.
Tell me. Why would anyone care about anything B. Gumbel has to opine about anything. Is he suppose to be intelligent? I thought he was just a newscaster looking for adulation.
John, you gave the clown the perfect answer. Good job!
You don't have HBO????
Is anyone besides me feeling more animosity towards the self-righteous players who keep publicly condemning the steroid abusers? Curt Schilling, Jack Clark, Carlton Fisk. Yes, we know you played the game the right way and players who didn't are apparently worse than child molsters... but SHUT THE **** UP already.
GUMBALL's is an idiot!!! I hope someone sues his A** off! my wife & I have been friends with the Bagwell's for many years. His power came from the gym over time and his batting stance (which created 'xtra torque' or xtra power in the speed of the swing). The last 5 seasons of his career were spent in pain as he sacrificed his right shoulder for Drayden's baseball business venture.
If JB was doing steroids, his friends would've known and as for the shoulder injury it became quite obvious he could spit farther than he could throw. In Bagwell's case any Doctor could've-would've prescribed steriods to treat his shoulder injury before any talk of a ban if it would help the healing process.
Lets all try not to forget that MLB is big business-big money so don't act suprised when team owners-management puts a little pressure on a player to get back in the game asap, especially if they can hit or throw a 95mph strike!
I'll bet most of the 103 names on that list had injuries they were dealing with but I'm also sure that a few used steroids for performance enhancement and not for an injury.
Gumble said what he did because he had a near death experience with cancer (to him anyway), and found a set of balls. I agree with everyone who posted "Where were you in the 90's Bryant, and why didn't you investigate it then?" Because I had a multi million dollar contract with CBS, and didn't want to become an earlier version of Dan Rather...friggin candy a$$.
Steroids has tainted EVERY professional sport in america. Thats after illegal drugs first decimated them. Amphetimines were the drug of choice in the 80's-90's (along with Cocaine). Alcohol has long been a problem in baseball. Just look at Miguel Cabrerra...
Players will continue to look for an edge, and with DNA research and genetic reasearch continuing to evolve, how long will it be until an athlete gets a treatment or something that alters him genetically? How the hell do you test for something like that? Those will be the questions people ask 100-200 years from now...
didnt mcgwire hit like 40 plus jacks his rookie and sophomore seasons. and all the reports i have read those years came before the steriods. the juice showed up after his first season ending injury i do believe.
media+seling+mlb= garbage.
ridiculous to believe owners didnt know about the PEDs. MLB knew about it. but baseball was going nowhere fast until mac and sosa showed up hitting bombs. chasing maris' record and america fell in love with baseball again. i remember where i was and who i called when i saw the record breaking homerun. these guys saved baseball. and people knew. but nobody was gonna bite the hand that was feeding them at the time. then some highschool kids die and get busted with steriods and the witch hunt was. but they waited for all these stars to finish(so they could suck the money out of their popularity) and burned them. took them out back and shot them like a broke down horse. get over it i grew up in a small town in texas and plenty of highschool athletes still use PEDs. make the ones that are safe like HGH legal. if it helps these guys recover faster from traveling across the country, playing day in and day out and playing a sport that most players dont truly take full offseasons until they are veterans so be it.
It was the "Steroid Era", and we can say, based on evidence, admission, and sometimes unfair speculation, that a great deal of juicing went on. Knowing "who" and "when" and "how many" is helpful in Hall of Fame balloting, but it really does not change anything. The best perspective I have gotten from all this is an increased appreciation for Roger Maris. No one else got to 61, before or after steroids. The feat itself, and the pressure that he endured (with no known drugs to take the "edge" off) seem even more incredible now. The guy should be in the Hall of Fame to offset the record he lost.
I just find it hilarious that he doesn't even mention Bonds.
There has never been any serious accusations on Bagwell at all. Gumbel is an idiot if he thinks Bagwells went from 50 homeruns to 10 over night. Bagwell was one of the most consistent players of his era. We do know for a fact that his decline was a bad shoulder. That was genetics because his father had the same condition. That is why his body became smaller. He could not weight train because of it. Someone show me proof on Bagwell before saying he did it. I am a big Astros fan but it would not surprise me if he did juice up but there is no proof and really no cloud over him. I am stating what we do know and steriods is not one of them.
WHAT journalistic standards????????????????
The media needs to stop this and yes, that includes EVERYONE! It's not news anymore - it's beating a dead horse!
Please name one case, just one, of any baseball player, any player at all, from the 60's, 50's, 40's, 30's, and 20's who has ever been accused of taking PED's? Just one. Tick. Tick. Tick. I'm waiting. Because in all of baseball history no one has ever accused, mentioned, brought forward evidence, whispered it, or said it happened from any baseball player playing in thea era. It's a weak agruement when someone says someone from the pre-steriod baseball area "might" have been on steriods--how do we know they weren't? as evidence that Henry Aaron, Roger Maris, or Babe Ruth might have been on steriods. You really sound stupid when you make this arguement as a steriod apoligist for a known steriod user like Bonds, McGuire, Sosa, Giambi, A-Rod, Big Papi, Manny, Nomar, and other roid users like Kevin Millar, Jason Veritek, Randi Velardi, Bret Boone, Paul Byrd, Mo Vaughn, Mike Stanton, and the rest of those losers!
Gumbel does not know anything now that all of us did not know when the whole world was wildly celebrating the McGuire-Sosa HR duels in prime time. But they were "saving baseball" so the fact they were juiced and we ALL knew it, from Bud Light Selig on down, was ignored. Anybody who said then that the whole thing was a disgrace (like the Maris family) was pilloried and ridiculed. The pundits expressing shock and outrage now were cheerleading vigorously when it mattered, so please stuff the hypocrisy and worry about your own failings.
Latex, you're still spelling steroid wrong.
Maybe it is time to start suing these reporters who make false accusations or accusations without proof. These writers seem to forget that they made alot of money off of the home run bogus era. They were just giddy about writing what Mark & Sammy were doing & it was all gravy. Now when shit it the fan & it all comes out, why is it we are only angry at the players? From the Commish down to the lowly scumbag reporters were in on it. Theyall covered it up, because rating were up on all levels. Bogus ass creeps like Bryan & Jeff get called out for being fakes. If I was one of those guys he mentioned I would be all over his sissy ass.
Anybody scratch their head about Brady Anderson's 1996 season?
Guy averages 19 home runs per year suddenly hits 50. Quick hands that year.
They haven't been accused because there is absolutely no way to bring forth any evidence. It's not like they have a urine/hair/blood sample from Babe Ruth from 1921 just sitting in a freezer for later testing. Therefore, since steroids existed in those "golden years" with no way to test for them in the human body, it is possible that *anyone* could have been on them without ever getting caught and without anyone ever knowing. Hence, your argument is baseless.
Did they exist. Did anyone use them. Babe Ruth and the other players from that era didn't have the bodys of steroid users. They looked more like beer and hotdog users. A theory has been advanced that is where the Babe got his power; from a steady stream of over the counter beer and hotdog use. This has neither been proven nor disproven. However, in the spring of 1925 the Babe collapsed, suffered a series of convulsions, and was operated on for an intestinal problem. He missed almost half of the 1925 playing season. Many other players of that era are also accused of consuming great quantities of food and alcohol in order to mimic the Babe's success. None of them was as successful at this as the Babe.
Anabolic steroids as we know them today? No. Research didn't really start on that train until the 1930's, but steroids in general? Yes. Other performance enhancing drugs? Yes. Did they work as well as what's available today? No. Did they use them? We have no way of knowing, and that's the point. People want to point back to players of previous decades and say "They did it clean!" Nobody knows that, nobody can prove it one way or another, and cheating is as ingrained into baseball as lying is to government officials. Since these methods of cheating were available, it doesn't take a leap in logic to state that it's *possible* that *some random player* was using during those decades. Therefore, pointing to any single player from these eras and categorically stating that "They did it clean!"...well...you don't really know that. Nobody knows that, and nobody will ever be able to definitively know that. It's a sad truth, but it's one people need to come to grips with. It's just like any other form of cheating. Some are doing it. Some aren't. Some filed the baseball before the pitch. Some didn't. Some who did got caught. Some didn't. Some never will. I'd be willing to bet that some other BALCO-like company has already found some other magic elixir that will be undetectable for the next 5-10 years and a handful of players are already taking it in multiple sports. It's a never-ending cycle of cops-and-robbers and it's been playing for a long, long time.
Lets shut down the discussion and and put all these half assed writers out on the street where they belong.
Anyone who thinks that Sheff, Pudge and the rest of the boys didn't indulge in steroids and/or HGH is kinda' out to lunch...
This is precisely why I think that the other 103 names that tested positive should be released by MLB. First, I will guarantee there are other high profile players on the list. 2nd, it gets it all out in the open, and clears those NOT on the list.
Everyone seems to be focused on the message rather than the messenger. We all have our own opinions, proof or no, about the use of steroids by major league players, but how this information is disseminated and discussed is almost as important as the story itself. If the story is put out in a slipshod and/or careless fashion, as this appears to have been, then the message gets diluted and overlooked. To me, the quality of the reporting enhances the seriousness of the discussion. This is a case in point. I'm not certain whether Craig Calcaterra wrote the italicized paragraph at the end of his article, but the words "lazy-ass...passive-aggressive condescending prick," aren't they descriptive of Bryant Gumbel? This guy may be the biggest fraud in all of sports media. All he does is pontificate about whatever is on his alleged mind. How, or better yet, why he still has a forum is inexplicable? Are there no producers and/or editors at HBO who monitor what this guy says and does? There seems to be no supervision on the content of his shows or the drab and dreary way he presents his stories. His sense of self-impotance is overwhelming. It seems to me HBO needs to go in another direction.
I want to accuse Gumbel of being an overrated, obnoxious, arrogant, blowhard pompous ass.
Really??????????? You mean Pudge lost a gazillion inches and hit many fewer homers....you had to be BLIND not to see the differences...HELLO....ANYONE HOME ??
It has been suggested that it's irresponsible for a journalist to suggest a player used steroids based strictly on circumstantial evidence, but an alternate view is that it's irresponsible NOT to suggest it. After all, some such players undoubtedly used steroids, and if we don't accuse them all and assume they're all guilty, some will escape accountability. Given the witch-hunt mentality that's popular today, they should ALL be banned from baseball and denied election to the Hall of Fame. Bravo to Gumbel for calling out Bagwell, Nomar, and Pudge. Let's accuse Griffey, Thome, Chipper, Sheffield, Delgado, and Andruw Jones too - just for starters.
misguided use of 'errors of connection' in any rsnt is tantamount to liable with malice
I saw maris play in person for many years. he was a great athelete
his ability to play the outfield with grace and glide was like dimaggio he never had to dive for a ball becasue he was always there . he had a gun for an arm and nobody ran on him . he was a true 5 tool player in the like of Clemente and mays my two favorites
he was a football great in ND and could have played pro but chose baseball..his body was really like a linebacker of today
his swing was short and compact and he pulled the outside pitch [ask Tracy stallard] one reason for the 61 was the fact that baseball expanded that year and a lot of double and triple a pitchers were in the bigs...and there were no closers then
maris was the home run king the year before and he was the mvp
he broke the thumb playing in 62 and never said a word he couldn't get his top hand over and it truly affected his swing for the rest of his career
the writers like Dick Young [ he ran seaver out of town] were merciliess and in treating maris Much lot of the BS repoted today about Maris comes from the Gossip innuendo and outright lies on Maris by young you can look it up my initial are RM and i am proud of it.
Gumbercules? I LOVE that guy!!!!
Who's Bryant Gumbel?
It's not the roids....It's them "Juiced" baseballs....Remember them hiding the truth from us that way?
I've definitely heard Bagwell's name dropped in other reports. I don't want to defend Gumbel, I could care less about him, but Bagwell's name isn't new to the steroid convo. And "Open letters are lazy-ass gimmicks with allow the writer", shouldn't that be ...which allow the writer...???
Gumbel should know about this. He is an expert. He took roid and vastly improved his broadcasting ability. He also got fat and changed his name to Gregg, but at least he is now a decent broadcaster
Isn't Bryan Gumbel supposed to be dead already?
Wake up, 70% of MLB was on the juice at one point or another. Put it this way, if I told you that you will make an additional $3,000,000 a year on your next deal if you hit more homers what would you do? Oh did I mention that more than half the starting pitchers were on them, so how is it cheating if they all did it? Before you answer all high and mighty, remember that if you don't take the juice your off the roster and making $50k in the minors for a year before they release you because 10 other guys will shoot up to take your job, you have no idea unless you have been in that position.
Have you ever said I would do anything to be that guy? Well the reason that guy was that guy is because he did it.